Guess Who is Endorsing Kerry *serious political stuff*

[ElfDude]

Can you show me some examples of drive-by shootings at any Kerry campaign headquarters? Or even protestors storming in at at any of the Kerry campaign headquarters and wrecking stuff and refusing to leave until police arrive?

I'm not being selective. I even went so far as to post a link to a story showing that both sides were sign stealing. But this other stuff is only happening on one side. If you can prove me wrong I'll eat crow and make a full apology right here in front of everybody.

[ElfDude]

The saga continues...

Bush's campaign office in Spokane burglarized [sic], vandalized.

http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/l ... ice11.html

I threw in the [sic] because the real word is "burgled", not "burlarized", but I guess the Seattle Times editor doesn't know that.

[Devil's Advocate]

Meanwhile, in the news: http://uk.news.yahoo.com/041011/325/f4cpk.html


So... what was that about the war making the world a safer place?

[ElfDude]

Wouldn't that post have been more appropiate over in the WMD thread? Oh well, we can change the subject again.

I went to the link and read it. Something really jumped out at me. The story reads, "Satellite imagery shows that entire buildings in Iraq have been dismantled. They once housed high-precision equipment that could help a government or terror group make nuclear bombs, the International Atomic Energy Agency said in a report to the U.N. Security Council on Monday.

Equipment and materials helpful in making bombs also have been removed from open storage areas in Iraq and disappeared without a trace, according to the satellite pictures, IAEA Director-General Mohamed ElBaradei said."

I thought everyone was claiming that none of that stuff existed... that if Saddam had ever had a nuclear program it was long gone. Now they're yelling, "Hey! Somebody is stealing all the stuff from Saddam's nuclear program that you can make WMD's with!"? So, were they lying two weeks ago or are they lying now?

[Devil's Advocate]

? So, were they lying two weeks ago or are they lying now?

Orrrrr it could be the material that Saddam had handed over to the UN inspectors.

[by-tor]

UN Inspectors

Out of all this, that's the biggest joke. Blix couldn't have found a 50 megaton warhead if it was detonated up his ass. The UN is sooooo yesterday.

[Devil's Advocate]

He also couldn't have found it if it wasn't there, or if a bunch of warmongers kicked him and his team out of Iraq so they could declare war.

[by-tor]

He also couldn't have found it if it wasn't there, or if a bunch of warmongers kicked him and his team out of Iraq so they could declare war.

Sorry DA, I'm going to have to disagree with ya there. Blix and his team were there for years, long before the 'warmongers' were even elected in the US. Numerous times during those years items popped up that were on the UN's ban list that they missed. Regardless of who was working in the Oval Office in the US, and your feelings about him, it doesn't change the fact that Blix and his team of 'inspectors' were incompotent before and after Bush took office. Maybe he was getting paid under the table to look the other way....lord knows that France and Russia were...I don't know. Hell, the man couldn't even find mortar shells that were fitted for chemical weapons when Iraq gave him the list for them. His team 'inspected' a rocket manfacturing facility, said everything was good, then we find out that Saddam was building rockets that exceeded the UN's allowed range at that facility while the 'inspectors' were there. Blix has less credibility than the UN itself.

[ElfDude]

Let's have fun with another recent Kerry flip-flop.

Let's go back to April 19th, 2004, in Lake Worth, Florida. You remember Bob Woodward's big book... the one in which he claimed that Bush and the Saudis had a secret plan to lower the price of oil before the election, and John Kerry did not like that at all, and this is what he said:

"If, as Bob Woodward reports, it is true that gas supplies and prices in America are tied to the American election -- then tied to a secret White House deal, that is outrageous and unacceptable to the American people."

Huh? The American president, if he did have the power to lower oil prices and gasoline prices, that would be unacceptable to the American people? But now John Kerry is basically demanding Bush do it. In Mew Mexico today Kerry, complaining about current oil prices, said:

"Four years ago, when he was running for president, George Bush said, quote, "What I think the president ought to do is get on the phone with the OPEC cartel and say, 'We expect to you open your spigots.'" Today, four years later with gas prices at a record level, we're still waiting for George Bush to make that phone call."

First he complains of the president arranging with OPEC a reduction in oil prices, and now he complains that Bush isn't arranging with OPEC a reduction in oil prices. Which is it, senator?

[Devil's Advocate]

The second quote is obviously just pointing out a broken promise.


But if you wanna talk about "flip-flopping," how about that Rumsfeld guy, huh?

[by-tor]

There are two problems with gas prices as I see it.

1) We rely too much on OPEC, and have almost totally forgotten what we have here in this country. My home state (Louisiana) used to have money, but then for some reason we decided to put a ton of U.S. oil workers out of work, close down rigs and wells, and get all our oil from OPEC. I say we open back our rigs and wells, put our people back to work, and send a clear message to OPEC that we don't need them. Better yet, take this money we're spending on the people who don't want to work in this country, and spend it on alternative fuel research.

2) Most in this country don't realize how good we have it gas wise. We currently pay what, about $2.00 a gallon for gas? There's almost 4 liters in a gallon, right? So about $0.50 - $0.60 a liter rough and dirty. DA, kindly tell us Americans how much petrol is in England right now.

[ElfDude]

Nah, he led up to the statement with a lot of whining about high oil prices and blaming them on the presidency. It wasn't just pointing out a broken promise, in nearly all of his speeches he reminds his supporters of what victims they are (really inspiring stuff).

One of the talk shows... Hardball with Chris Matthews I think... had Bob Woodward and others on one night last spring. No... I think it was actually Larry King Live. Anyway, they were surprised when the prince of Saudi Arabia called in. He pointed out that every president the US has had in his memory has called him with the same request to lower oil prices, and that there has never been anything secretive about it. He mentioned George W., Clinton, Bush Sr., Ronald Reagan, and even Jimmy Carter calling "for us to help him out of his malaise..."

Bush made the calls he promised to make. He was just hit with the reality (as were all his predecessors) that no US president has control over OPEC. So, he has made proposals for further US oil development to lessen our dependance on OPEC, and John Kerry votes against them all (while complaining of our dependance on foreign oil).

It's been fun. Kerry makes such grand and bold statements on issues. But then it always turns out that within the last year or two he has made an equally grand and bold statement on the opposite side of the issue. His whole campaign is based on the hope that nobody has been paying attention to anything he's said or done previous to last September.

[by-tor]

Gas prices in the rest of the world cannot be blamed on this president...on any other president for that matter. My first time in Europe in '85, gas worked out to about $2.00 - $2.50 a gallon over there, where it was around $0.55 - $0.80 here. If anything, the rest of the world can 'blame' the US for lowering prices. I wonder how many Euporeans remember what gas cost before the US started buying heavily from OPEC.

[Devil's Advocate]

2) Most in this country don't realize how good we have it gas wise. We currently pay what, about $2.00 a gallon for gas? There's almost 4 liters in a gallon, right? So about $0.50 - $0.60 a liter rough and dirty. DA, kindly tell us Americans how much petrol is in England right now.

Not sure exactly, but it's over ?0.80 per litre.


Google says: 1 US gallon = 3.7854118 litres

So we're paying just over ?3 per gallon. And there's about $1.7 per pound (higher than I thought, but anyway... ), so petrol here would be around $5 per gallon.

[ElfDude]

So we're paying just over ?3 per gallon. And there's about $1.7 per pound (higher than I thought, but anyway... ), so petrol here would be around $5 per gallon.

Yep. When I lived in Belgium it was the same story. I know petrol prices suck over there. But most of the price difference is in the amount of taxation, isn't it? Any idea what you're taxed per litre? Over here the tax amounts are posted on the pumps.